Nice la Presse Article on XO this morning

[Lunaseraphim]

I was responding to another poster that said "you pay someone for sex it is a kind of ''class abuse'' where you use your economical power to use the body of someone that is systemically oppressed",
and I disagreed for the reasons I stated. I never implied sex workers are intentionnaly "taking advantage" of lonely men, just that, in that context, the power imbalance shifts, that's all. If that is a problem, well i dont know what to say anymore.

I'm saying that because I have heard people imply this and even say it out right many times. I had to stop talking to a friend of mine because of it. But other than that, I don't disagree, it's true that in some cases the power dynamic evens itself out, and sometimes turns in the favor of the provider.. It's just that it's not always the case, and I find that the sex workers who truly use that power are not really that common, because at the end of the day we are at the mercy of the market, just like any independent worker.

10% of the cients will cause 90% of the issues. And by creating fear or discomfort in Sp we stray even further from what could be a genuine moment. Where at some point it might feel like ordering from a mc menu...Fake smile, check. nervousness, check. No one wants that. Yes it is theatre, and beautiful make belief in the end. But the time, experience can be real and fulfil both parties. I do enjoy your inputs, and I do beleive it does educates or at least inform. Please keep going (If you do feel like it...)

You are totally right.. I feel the same way as you on this. It's not always theater, by the way. Really often I feel like my interactions with clients are genuine. I do feel like I have to perform a little or curate the version of me that the client is seeing, but when I really hit it off with someone, I am not hiding.

If any activity is not criminal, i.e. not against the law by all participating parties, by definition it is the legal activity.

No.. Legalization implies that the government is in control of the activity. It's completely different from decriminalization, which allows more freedom for everyone, particularly more marginalized sex workers. I've said this many times. For instance, if weed had been decriminalized, dispensaries would have popped up that are not SQDC, and private dealers would have continued selling without fearing LE. Now we have to go to the SQDC, and some THC products are illegal in quebec, for dumb reasons... It's also still illegal to buy weed from an individual, and I believe from somebody to grow weed and sell it.

But also I don't really understand the point you're making.

 

[LeDodo]

Looks like this thread is not about XO anymore lol.

That's merb

 

[LeDodo]

A lot of pimps are women.. and it doesn't have anything to do with "high end" or "low end". These terms don't even mean anything. There are women who pose as "assistants" but are taking a cut from the escorts they "manage" and exploit them in various ways. I think we're running around in circles honestly.

Well the latest one who had lights on her is Ghislaine Maxwell. Perfect example of decoy to gain the girl's trust.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

I'm trying to find Lea Rose's comment in which she talks about her poor experiences at agencies which she graciously does not name, to remind people what the subject of the thread is. You would think if a highly reviewed and serious provider says her experiences, she will be taken seriously. All I did was repeat what people who want to remain anonymous told me. I'm not a mod but I think this thread should be closed and we should all be going back on it and reading everything carefully and reflecting.

 

[LeDodo]

I'm trying to find Lea Rose's comment in which she talks about her poor experiences at agencies which she graciously does not name, to remind people what the subject of the thread is. You would think if a highly reviewed and serious provider says her experiences, she will be taken seriously. All I did was repeat what people who want to remain anonymous told me. I'm not a mod but I think this thread should be closed and we should all be going back on it and reading everything carefully and reflecting.

Here you go

Wow. “They will make up to you” by what ?! Making the girl works for free to you ?
God. I have work for agencies and let me tell you that it was hell. Very happy to be independent and have boundaries set for myself and not set by a guy.
Sex work is expensive. If you don’t have the money for it don’t do it.
God this thread makes me soooooo mad

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Well the latest one who had lights on her is Ghislaine Maxwell. Perfect example of decoy to gain the girl's trust.

Yes, and from what I've read and from what I've heard it's a common recruiting tactic.. or a common tactic to lower somebody's defenses in a new work place. Maxwell was also not at the top of the scheme here. This is about sex trafficking which is much different.. But I've had friends told me that female bookers acted like complete bullies at agencies. I've seen this with secretaries at parlors as well.. I remember one secretary urged me to stay later (it was already 5am) to see this ''easy client''. The guy was on a ton of coke and stealthed me. I found out later no one else wanted to see him because he did it to them as well.

 

[Lunaseraphim]

Here you go

Thank you. I want to repeat that I don't believe all agencies are exploitative in the same way XO was proven to be after multiple testimonies.
Maybe some of which aren't here on this forum. One colleague confirmed what I suspected. The bosses don't do it to all girls, they only do it to the ones that they view as easily used and manipulated. Someone who worked for XO asked someone I know ''is it normal to fuck the booker to get clients''... It's hard because nobody wants to actually show up here and give testimonies. Almost no one here who wants to comment worked for XO or wants to say something bad about having worked for agencies, and most of what is being said is repeated by another girl like me or by another client..

Anyways we have enough here to work with.. I hope you all have a good night. This discussion was really exhausting for me in the past few days, brought back a lot of memories from both my work and civilian lives, and I think I'll step out for a while.

 

[2fast2slow]

I'm not a mod but I think this thread should be closed and we should all be going back on it and reading everything carefully and reflecting.

I beleive this thread is the most interesting thread on merb in a long time, and this situation with XO has been the biggest 'eye opener" the Montreal scene has had in a long time. I believe the thread should continue until everybody has had their chance to relate their experiences and opinions and until people get exhausted. Speaking of getting exhausted...

 

[Lunaseraphim]

I beleive this thread is the most interesting thread on merb in a long time, and this situation with XO has been the biggest 'eye opener" the Montreal scene has had in a long time. I believe the thread should continue until everybody has had their chance to relate their experiences and opinions and until people get exhausted. Speaking of getting exhausted...

Maybe you're right, but it feels like a lot of people continue wanting to believe what they want to believe. I think it's good that this is creating a discussion... But a lot of the same comments and complaints that I usually see on this board seem to constantly resurface through the thread and a lot of important elements are lost because people aren't reading all of it... Do you see what I mean? It just feels like eventually a lot of people will stop participating and this will be an echo chamber..

And yes I'm exhausted.. sweet dreams.

 

[minutemenX]

No.. Legalization implies that the government is in control of the activity. It's completely different from decriminalization, which allows more freedom for everyone, particularly more marginalized sex workers. I've said this many times. For instance, if weed had been decriminalized, dispensaries would have popped up that are not SQDC, and private dealers would have continued selling without fearing LE. Now we have to go to the SQDC, and some THC products are illegal in quebec, for dumb reasons... It's also still illegal to buy weed from an individual, and I believe from somebody to grow weed and sell it.

But also I don't really understand the point you're making.

Alcohol is not criminalized but you can only buy strong alcohol at SAQ and restaurants selling alcohol need to pay for government permit. If your activity is decriminalized it must be regulated as any other economic activity. You must provide documentation (ledgers etc) that reflects your cash flow and the buisiness expenses and fill all the tax documents required for small non-incorporated business. You would also need to pay GST/QST if your activity exceeds $30K/year. For this you need to charge your clients GST/QST on top of your price. There is no way that you can avoid government control and regulations that are mandatory for any small businesses (permits, health issues etc). How you can justify that you can be free from it while hairdresser working at his salon is not. What I am trying to say is that decriminalization and legalization is the same thing.
Government would also push you to move away from pure cash operation and you should be able to accept interact and credit cards payments.

 

[Batista Mason]

The fact that they knew your first name is very spooky...
I suspect Agencies have a way of doing a soft background check.

I googled my own phone number and my full name and city came up...I had it removed by submitting a request though

Could be, I believe in my case, it was an SP who just casually said my first name when talking about me since they probably don't know my username here.

I went to re-check the PM from XO that said my first name and it was just a PM telling me an SP went to have a nose surgery and that she will be back.

But yeah, if your phone number is not private. Anyone can just type in Google and find your personal info.

I remember an SP in Nadya's VIP I met in 2017, she is very kind but also naive, she was only 20-21 years old at that time. She told me she trusted a client her phone number to chat together outside appointments and he found her Facebook just by typing her phone number in the Facebook search bar. That's also allowed him to find the identity of her SP friend because they were best friends and they had a lot of photos together. From what I remember, the client tried using that to his advantage for free services or he will expose her sex work to her family and friends on Facebook, that eventually lead her to quit and leaving Montreal after debuting around 6 months ago. After she quits, this is when I started to learn about the abuse of the booker from other SPs who were in other agency and coincidentally, Nadya's VIP stop advertising here.

Now that I am talking about Nadya's VIP, it just reminded me of another story. They managed to have former pornstar Jemma Valentine on their roster, I managed to see her only once and had a great time with her. She didn't stay long and later I saw her post on social media that she experienced something very bad as an escort that lead her to leave Montreal and she said she will never come back to this city. I think she continued her pornstar career and eventually just quit the sex business. Her last update on Twitter was in 2018.

I remember reading that Nadya's VIP bought/took control of the blue board (Merc) and any good reviews for Euphoria and XO would be deleted and get you banned. It basically turned in a Nadya's VIP advertisement.

I don't know if Nadya's VIP is still active today. I just typed in Google and now it leads me to something called Chateau Nadia but it just a wedding dress site. So I think that agency is dead after all.

 

[EagerBeaver]

If your activity is decriminalized it must be regulated as any other economic activity. You must provide documentation (ledgers etc) that reflects your cash flow and the buisiness expenses and fill all the tax documents required for small non-incorporated business. You would also need to pay GST/QST if your activity exceeds $30K/year.

Any economic activity is not getting formally decriminalized without the government's taxing entity having figured out a way to tax the proceeds of it legally and require the participants to submit to that government implemented scheme.

And of course, the cost of whatever taxes the SPs have to pay under this government implemented scheme will be passed on to you in the price you pay to her.

The only certain things in life are death and taxes. This I learned when my father died and left me an inheritance in the form of an IRA. In the USA, it used to be the law that you could withdraw the money in an inherited IRA over the course of your lifetime (presumably, when you retire, if you are still working) and pay taxes on it as you do so. This is no longer the law since 2020. The IRS now forces you to withdraw all of the money in an inherited IRA over 10 years, starting in the year you inherited it. Even if you are not retired, are working and making an adequate income, and do not need the IRA money! IT'S BECAUSE THEY WANT THEIR PIECE OF THE PIE AND THEY WILL FORCE YOU TO CUT THAT PIE EVEN IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO EAT IT UNTIL LATER. THEY CONTROL THE PIE, NEVER FORGET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[AnthonyAnderson]

I meant i was expecting the charges to be dropped and her resuming her work by now. Since she has not i assume its more serious.

Why would charges be dropped? I tried to look but it's really not easy to get this information online. By the way, did you remember that she was charged with the following counts as well?

• Possession for the Purpose of Trafficking – Cocaine
• Possession for the Purpose of Trafficking – Fentanyl

As always, the suspect is presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

Also worth noting that media uses "human trafficking" in their headline while no such charges have been pressed, according to the same article.

Halton police charge woman in human trafficking case

Investigators allege that over an 18-month period, an adult female victim was trafficked in the sex trade across the Greater Toronto Area.

toronto.citynews.ca

 

[EagerBeaver]

Also worth noting that media uses "human trafficking" in their headline while no such charges have been pressed, according to the same article.

Indeed, no such charges have been pressed:

"Genest-Matte has been charged with two counts of procuring, two counts of receiving a material benefit from sexual services, two counts of advertising sexual services, possession for the purpose of trafficking cocaine, possession for the purpose of trafficking fentanyl, and laundering proceeds of crime."

I agree that the drug and laundering charges potentially complicate an early resolution of the type HM is suggesting. It's not even 6 months since she was charged and is early in the game. It's very likely the case is still pending and "Bianca White" and her attorneys still have work to do to get them resolved. Not likely that they just get dropped, but if she is a first time offender, there is always hope for a resolution that keeps her out of the slammer.

 

[Léa_rose5]

https://merb.cc/xenforo/threads/nice-la-presse-article-on-xo-this-morning.253434/page-7#post-1828215

A gentle note:
The dynamic isn’t solely defined by the owner or the booker. Clientele can also shape the experience, at times in more challenging ways (though certainly not all). There is, in my experience, a distinct difference between agency and independent clientele. Simply something to keep in mind when forming an impression of a provider

 

[LeDodo]

A gentle note:
The dynamic isn’t solely defined by the owner or the booker. Clientele can also shape the experience, at times in more challenging ways (though certainly not all). There is, in my experience, a distinct difference between agency and independent clientele. Simply something to keep in mind when forming an impression of a provider

Thanks for sharing your experience and happy to see you have more control over your clientele.

 

[Léa_rose5]

Oh and it’s also funny to consider that EVERYONE is being “manage or dictate” by someone else… the Government, our bosses, the companies we work for, etc.
But since it’s not related to Sex Work is okay and acceptable…
So yes, I do have a Pimp, The government.
shocking right ?! Hahahaha

 

[TheJames101]

As an aside, there will be more developments in the legal case against XO. This thread seems a good place to put that when the time comes. Best keep it open, therefore.

 

[EagerBeaver]

Oh and it’s also funny to consider that EVERYONE is being “manage or dictate” by someone else… the Government, our bosses, the companies we work for, etc.
But since it’s not related to Sex Work is okay and acceptable…
So yes, I do have a Pimp, The government.
shocking right ?! Hahahaha

A great song about institutional control over the individual, which fits with your post:

 

[Lunaseraphim]

A gentle note:
The dynamic isn’t solely defined by the owner or the booker. Clientele can also shape the experience, at times in more challenging ways (though certainly not all). There is, in my experience, a distinct difference between agency and independent clientele. Simply something to keep in mind when forming an impression of a provider

I agree. I used to charge agency rates and lower so I know what you mean. It's not everyone for sure... But that's kinda what I wanted to point out last night. Clients do have some power over our experiences, and they absolutely can change the demand.

It's easy to blame the pimp/employer as the only source of evil but at the same time they are catering to something.