Hamas & Israel

[minutemenX]

This is an endless discussion that do not convince people firmly adhering to one side. Blaming, does not solve the problem, just justifies your already established opinion. Some realistic solution needs to be found ASAP to end the cycle of violence.

What we have in Gaza.

We have 2M+ people in practically densest population in the world. What is the economy of Gaza? They produce practically nothing with exception of small amount of agricultural produce. They do not have any sizable industry, any intellectual base for HiTec or bunking. They import practically everything: water, gas , electricity (all from Israel), food and all industrial goods from all over the world. How society that produces nothing survives? It is basically a welfare state that survives on donations from UN, industrial countries and a lot of cash from rich Arab states especially from Gulf such as Qatar and Iran (probably again through Qatar). A lot of this aid comes with a caveat. The caveat is that the recipients need to demonstrate “straggle” with Israeli “occupation”. Hamas is the clearing house practically for all aid and ensures that the “struggle” is going on. It feeds its bureaucrats, paramilitary force, and people that are employed in "military industries” (shops manufacturing rockets, tunnel builders etc). There is no way to survive in Gaza if you are not with Hamas, both ideologically and participating in the terrorist activity directly or indirectly. With endless brainwashing that glorifies martyrdom practically the whole Gaza is a terrorist enterprise. Destroying Hamas would solve little as any other administration recruited from locals will be immediately corrupted by “free” money coming with anti-Israeli caveat and the inherited ideology and would probably recreate Hamas-like structure.

What to do (utopia).

In short: stop flow of free money. This includes any support for the so- called Palestinian refugees. It is the only group of people on Earth that inherits refugee status primarily now from grandparents never actually been to the territory they are claiming refugee from. If we apply this rule to American and Canadians, they would be instantly transformed to Germans, Italian, French, Hungarians etc. with rights to their “ancestral” places and the compensation from them. The international support needs to go instead exclusively for the industry and agriculture development by foreign entrepreneurs and companies supplementing it with their own investments. The factories built by Israelis on the Gaza border can be also rejuvenated. This of course needs time to develop. As an interim solution, the program sponsoring unmarried men and women from Gaza to work and study abroad should be initiated. Considering no language barrier, hundreds of thousands can find an immediate employment in Gulf States and Saudi Arabia replacing Indians and Thais (these can go to Israel). They should pay taxes to Gaza to support elderly and youth. This program will remove the most vulnerable population strata from the toxic ideology also helping them to accumulate money for study and marriage. In parallel, sponsored education abroad primarily in trade schools will prepare work force for growing domestic industry. The bottom line is: no more “free money” . The money is only paid for productive work in industry, agriculture and service supervised first by foreign campanies directly to a worker without any clearing house as in any civilized country.

 

[Halloween Mike]

Why pick sides? They both seem horrible. Here's my plan to fix things. It's a wee bit drastic, but hear me out. Give everyone in the area a month to clear out. Housing and transportation will be provided to those that need it. Once everyone's gone, drop so many nukes that the area will be inhabitable for centuries.

No more "holy land" means they no longer have that reason to fight. Will they still fight? Maybe, but at least they'll have to be honest about their motivations. Religion is fine when when you keep it to yourself and those interested. When it leads to mass-death, it's a disease that needs to be treated.

So you want to destroy the only Jewish country in the world? Where you relocate these peoples? In Arab countries? So they get purged again? I hope this was just satire. The truth is the Israelis have a reason to fight for their COUNTRY, the "Palestinians" are simply Arab Muslim that could live in Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Lebannon or any other Arab country in the region. They are not even a "country". "Palestine" was never a country. Before the reformation of Israel, it was just a piece of land that was swing around from one country to the other. Last 2 being Ottomans and Brits.

Its true that Israel is not squeaky clean. Facts. But between each side, its easier to see wich one is the worst.

 

[Halloween Mike]

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I'm frankly amazed that there are still people who are so hateful, racist and cruel that they can still in July 2025 feel no shame in openly professing their full support for the most heinous, cruel and sadistic crimes against overwhelmingly civilians, mostly against children. There are no words strong enough to describe it.

I don't know if it's willful ignorance, or if people are fully aware and support it, it doesn't matter because they're just as culpable either way.

I have to admit that I've still been quite surprised at how far people have been willing to degrade their humanity by defending the most vile crimes. I would not have ever guessed that so many people literally had no red line that, if crossed, would be going too far. But here we are, and I've had to acknowledge that there are people who will literally defend anything Israel could do to Palestinians. It's both disturbing and eye opening.

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And personally i am amaze you defend a terrorist group, and as minutemenx perfectly explain it, a region that is infuse of perpetual hatred, and you don't even remotely condemn anything about them. I couldn't had said better than he did when it comes to explaining Gaza radicalization.

Its so easy to usue the racist card when in fact it has to do with extremism in religion before any concept of "race". Heck North Korea and South Korea are both Koreans, yet we condemn only one of the 2, why do you think? One is an extremist country under dictatorship that wish death upon us, the other is our allies. So please stop with this race card, its just an excuse.


As i said Israel is not "squeaky clean" and there is a lot of things i question. One for a fact is the death at the humanitarian aid distribution. But to think a war could go on without any civilian deaths, especially when the ennemies are purposely embled in civilian population because THEY COUNT on these deaths to fuel their propaganda machine, that would be impossible.

Why i don't see you condemn the massacre and killing of Gazans by their own peoples? Why i don't see you condemn the massacre of Druz in Syria? Why you don't actively militate against actual genocide happening right now in the world? Why its already "Israel bad"?

My humanity is fully there. Heck yesterday i was in my bed in the dark half asleep and heard a buzzing in my ear, my reflex was to of course get there with my hand and in the process once i opened the light i realized i squeashed a little butterfly. I felt so bad. They are harmless. I didn't wanted to kill it. It was purely a reflex. Worst is that it was still moving a little bit but clearly it was too squished, so i had to "finish it" to end its suffering. That hurt me. Truly ! My humanity was also very hurt on Oct 7 when i saw all these defenseless peoples brutally murdered. And i saw only the tip... The reports of what some of them endured trough torture is bone chilling.

I never hidden the fact i always was against islamist, and for years our countries have bleed because of these religions extremists, it just happen Oct 7 was the drip that made the glass overflow. As horrible as the other massacre were (Paris, London, Russia, Boston etc) it was always a matter of killing peoples. And yes thats horrible itself, but between dying from a gunshot and dying after rape and torture, i think one is worst than the other.

You're indignation at peoples like me is only reciprocrated at my indignation of peoples like you who can't even condemn terrorist acts of the most brutal barbaric ways.

The reality is in Canada and the USA, and Europe, peoples evolved for the better. We became civilized and condemn as a society the barbaric ways that our ancestors used. (Look up the execution of William Wallace if you want to see barbary) But not every country, every nation, evolved the same. South America has a huge problem with Cartels and corruption, and the Arab world has a huge problem with radical Islam. Its not everyone of course, but its big enough that it overflow the other side.

Afghanistan is probably the best exemple of the radical islam issue in the middle east. We spent 20 years trying to make that country "normal", better, and in 48h once we thrown the towel it fallen back into Islamist hands that were just waiting for the power force that was there to leave. The good Afghans got overrun by the bad Afghans in less than 48h... Thats not normal. You would not see our army or police be overflown in Canada by drug dealers and street gangs that want to take control... But there, its a systemic issue.

 

[Zero_Six]

So you want to destroy the only Jewish country in the world? Where you relocate these peoples? In Arab countries? So they get purged again? I hope this was just satire. The truth is the Israelis have a reason to fight for their COUNTRY, the "Palestinians" are simply Arab Muslim that could live in Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Lebannon or any other Arab country in the region. They are not even a "country". "Palestine" was never a country. Before the reformation of Israel, it was just a piece of land that was swing around from one country to the other. Last 2 being Ottomans and Brits.

Its true that Israel is not squeaky clean. Facts. But between each side, its easier to see wich one is the worst.

When children can't learn to share their toy, you take the toy away. The toy in this situation is the "holy land", but instead of a couple kids pulling each others hair or giving each other a fat lip, they're (both sides) killing people. Lots of people.

I wont claim to have studied the conflict in great depth but it doesn't seem like there's that big difference between the two. The Jewish people needed a place, but not any place. It had to be that chunk of land, even though there were people already there and it was surrounded by people that hate them. With international support, they kept taking more and more land until the people living there got fed up and fought back.

It would be like if my landlord told me I'd have to start sharing my apartment with some guy that claims he lived here 50 years ago. At first we just share the place, but he starts taking over more and more of the place and saying it's his birth right. Eventually, I need to start asking permission to get a glass of water from the sink and sometimes the answer is no. I complain to the landlord and TAL, but they do nothing.

We have plenty of land in Canada. They're both welcome to come here so long as they can behave themselves.

 

[Halloween Mike]

When children can't learn to share their toy, you take the toy away. The toy in this situation is the "holy land", but instead of a couple kids pulling each others hair or giving each other a fat lip, they're (both sides) killing people. Lots of people.

The Jewish people needed a place, but not any place. It had to be that chunk of land, even though there were people already there and it was surrounded by people that hate them. With international support, they kept taking more and more land until the people living there got fed up and fought back.


We have plenty of land in Canada. They're both welcome to come here so long as they can behave themselves.

First of all you don't nuke anything for "fun" as its terrible for the environement and nukes should be dissuasive only and never actually used. Secondly maybe you should study a little more on the subject if you are to bring "solutions" to it. You know for instance that the reasons Jews were brough back to their ancestral home is because of the holocaust? It was to make sure they would have their own country again so this could not happen again. Zionism is simply the right for their return of the Jewish peoples to their ancestral home and be self suficient.

They didn't simply "took more and more until the peoples there got fed up". There was a partition by the British Empire (who actually owned the land at the time) wich Israel accepted, while Arab nations didn't and attacked them. As a result of that war wich Israel won, they took more territories. Now if we are talking today MY solution personally would be to give half the westbank to Jordan (the part where its controled by the PLO), and make the other part Israel. Once done, the frontier would be defined and unviolable for the futur, as in Israel can't take more. I would do similar with Gaza and let Egypt have it almost entirely exept a "buffer zone", like the demilitarized zone between the Koreas, just to ensure no attack can come from there ever again. But the issue is even Egypt do not want the "palestinian problem". Even fellow arab muslim do not want them... that tell a lot.

We have plenty of land in Canada yes, but there is a reason why most peoples live in the South. Would like to live in the North West territories or Yukon? Now i guess with a lot of developement over decades it could become "better" but it would still be a hard climate nontheless. Same way why Sibera is not populated as Moscow...

 

[Zero_Six]

First of all you don't nuke anything for "fun" as its terrible for the environement and nukes should be dissuasive only and never actually used. Secondly maybe you should study a little more on the subject if you are to bring "solutions" to it. You know for instance that the reasons Jews were brough back to their ancestral home is because of the holocaust? It was to make sure they would have their own country again so this could not happen again. Zionism is simply the right for their return of the Jewish peoples to their ancestral home and be self suficient.

They didn't simply "took more and more until the peoples there got fed up". There was a partition by the British Empire (who actually owned the land at the time) wich Israel accepted, while Arab nations didn't and attacked them. As a result of that war wich Israel won, they took more territories. Now if we are talking today MY solution personally would be to give half the westbank to Jordan (the part where its controled by the PLO), and make the other part Israel. Once done, the frontier would be defined and unviolable for the futur, as in Israel can't take more. I would do similar with Gaza and let Egypt have it almost entirely exept a "buffer zone", like the demilitarized zone between the Koreas, just to ensure no attack can come from there ever again. But the issue is even Egypt do not want the "palestinian problem". Even fellow arab muslim do not want them... that tell a lot.

We have plenty of land in Canada yes, but there is a reason why most peoples live in the South. Would like to live in the North West territories or Yukon? Now i guess with a lot of developement over decades it could become "better" but it would still be a hard climate nontheless. Same way why Sibera is not populated as Moscow...

I'm well aware of the Holocaust and it leading to the formation (reclaiming?) of Israel. I fully agree that they need their own country. I don't agree that it had to be that piece of land.

If we're using the logic that it was their ancestral home and they deserved to have it back, then perhaps we should pack up and give Canada back to the Indigenous people. Same for America, Australia and countless other places. The Indigenous people have more of a case IMO considering that the Jewish people lost Israel close to 2000 years ago. My ancestors were mostly Welsh. Do I get a chunk of land in Wales because some English people stole my ancestor's land back in the 12th century?

Nuking the place isn't really an option, but I don't think other solutions will work either. These people are too religious and the grudge too deep. Checkpoints and borders might slow down the destruction and killing, but it wont stop it. I guess we'll just let Israel go ahead and build.. what are they calling it? A "relocation camp"? The way you're talking about the Palestinian's probably isn't much different than how some people were talking about the Jewish people back in the 40s.

 

[Halloween Mike]

I fully agree that they need their own country. I don't agree that it had to be that piece of land.

The way you're talking about the Palestinian's probably isn't much different than how some people were talking about the Jewish people back in the 40s.

1) What land can it be then? Its not like the Earth ain't already pretty much populated beside the places that are not really well to live (pretty sure Israel in Antartica wouldn't had worked...) There was also Jews still living there. Considering the religious nature of the Jews, and how much Israel is mentioned in the religious books and the whole "holy land" as you say, it just made sense to be that land. Also happened that it wasn't a country anyway, just a land that was toss around during different conquest. There is actually many Arabs that accepted to make peace with Israel. Are you aware there is 2 millions Arab Muslim in Israel? They have the same rights as anyone.

2) The Natives case is very different. Our ancestors built this country. Most of the land was innocupied. There was some "villages" here and there, but its not like it was an European city-like or something. If i recall correctly my history, the French actually were mostly allied with the natives during the wars. Its more on the Brits side that it was the worst.

3) "The way i speak of the Palestinians" ? I only speak facts. There are mostly radicalized to the core. Thats what happen when a generation grow under a religious fanatic regime. But unlike Nazis or North Korean for instance, their radicalizing is not only in politics, but in religion, making it extremely more difficult to deradicalize. Because not only they must realize their governement (Hamas) is a terror organization that is evil, but on top they must learn that their religious ways are not "the way". Its sad in a way because its not the children's fault, yet they grow to become (not all, but a lot of them), radicalized terrorists. Thats all they know. The problem is not just in Gaza by the way, its in many islamic countries... I watched an "conversation" between a Jew and an Iranian soldier the other day on youtube. It was an omegle thing. The young soldier (about 20 or 21...really young) said he would die for the Ayatollah, and im paraphrasing but basically his word is the way. I don't know about you but i wouldn't die for Carney, Legault, Trump (if you are American) or any of the former Prime Ministers/Presidents or even their opposition. Its not a normal way to live.

I guess we could debate on this for hours, but personally what shocked me the most from Oct 7 was not the terrorists doing their evil, i saw similar things before like Cartel violence or other terrorists attacks. It was to see the civilians who would cheer, applaude, shout, while dead bodies were parade like hunting trophies. And not IDF soldiers, but regular civilians including young woman. Even saw what looks like a teenager spitting on a body (Shani Louk). Was it "all of Gaza"? No... but it was a very concerning ammount of peoples gathered, and of all ages and such. These were not Hamas terrorists...

 

[poupsy]

When children can't learn to share their toy, you take the toy away. The toy in this situation is the "holy land", but instead of a couple kids pulling each others hair or giving each other a fat lip, they're (both sides) killing people. Lots of people.

I wont claim to have studied the conflict in great depth but it doesn't seem like there's that big difference between the two. The Jewish people needed a place, but not any place. It had to be that chunk of land, even though there were people already there and it was surrounded by people that hate them. With international support, they kept taking more and more land until the people living there got fed up and fought back.

It would be like if my landlord told me I'd have to start sharing my apartment with some guy that claims he lived here 50 years ago. At first we just share the place, but he starts taking over more and more of the place and saying it's his birth right. Eventually, I need to start asking permission to get a glass of water from the sink and sometimes the answer is no. I complain to the landlord and TAL, but they do nothing.

We have plenty of land in Canada. They're both welcome to come here so long as they can behave themselves.

Your analogy and analysis is unfortunately not accurate

The land was legitimately and legally divided between the 2 . Arab People who stayed in israel are muslims that are very happy about not listening to arab neighbors to leave while they clean the land from the jews back in 1948. Now they enjoy freedom and democracy like no other arab country can offer.
The other became an instrument to perpetuate the so called Palestinian problem that could have been solved more than 6 times .

Also Jordania ( a chunk of was just given to Abdullah .. no indignation .
India and Pakistan split about the same time… no indignation

If only arabs have accepted israel right to exist the problem would have been solved long time ago but the Palestinian cause is intentionally perpetuated by states who just want to see israel wipped out.

Our stupid students embracing the Palestinians cause are just promoting this genocidal agenda

 

[Zero_Six]

1) What land can it be then? Its not like the Earth ain't already pretty much populated beside the places that are not really well to live (pretty sure Israel in Antartica wouldn't had worked...) There was also Jews still living there. Considering the religious nature of the Jews, and how much Israel is mentioned in the religious books and the whole "holy land" as you say, it just made sense to be that land. Also happened that it wasn't a country anyway, just a land that was toss around during different conquest. There is actually many Arabs that accepted to make peace with Israel. Are you aware there is 2 millions Arab Muslim in Israel? They have the same rights as anyone.

2) The Natives case is very different. Our ancestors built this country. Most of the land was innocupied. There was some "villages" here and there, but its not like it was an European city-like or something. If i recall correctly my history, the French actually were mostly allied with the natives during the wars. Its more on the Brits side that it was the worst.

3) "The way i speak of the Palestinians" ? I only speak facts. There are mostly radicalized to the core. Thats what happen when a generation grow under a religious fanatic regime. But unlike Nazis or North Korean for instance, their radicalizing is not only in politics, but in religion, making it extremely more difficult to deradicalize. Because not only they must realize their governement (Hamas) is a terror organization that is evil, but on top they must learn that their religious ways are not "the way". Its sad in a way because its not the children's fault, yet they grow to become (not all, but a lot of them), radicalized terrorists. Thats all they know. The problem is not just in Gaza by the way, its in many islamic countries... I watched an "conversation" between a Jew and an Iranian soldier the other day on youtube. It was an omegle thing. The young soldier (about 20 or 21...really young) said he would die for the Ayatollah, and im paraphrasing but basically his word is the way. I don't know about you but i wouldn't die for Carney, Legault, Trump (if you are American) or any of the former Prime Ministers/Presidents or even their opposition. Its not a normal way to live.

I guess we could debate on this for hours, but personally what shocked me the most from Oct 7 was not the terrorists doing their evil, i saw similar things before like Cartel violence or other terrorists attacks. It was to see the civilians who would cheer, applaude, shout, while dead bodies were parade like hunting trophies. And not IDF soldiers, but regular civilians including young woman. Even saw what looks like a teenager spitting on a body (Shani Louk). Was it "all of Gaza"? No... but it was a very concerning ammount of peoples gathered, and of all ages and such. These were not Hamas terrorists...

1. IDK, but it seems like they picked the worst possible place. Kind of makes me wonder if it was intentional. Disrupt the middle-east, provide support to the source of the disruption, carry on with Western progress as the middle-east fights among themselves. We're still fighting the Crusades, we're just using different tactics.

2. Why do villages matter? They had a different way of life that didn't involve milking the land dry. I'd hate to give up my modern conveniences, but maybe their way of life was better in the long run. I'll bet climate change wouldn't be as big an issue if we were living their way. Maybe I wouldn't spend most my summer days sweating my balls off.

3. I don't know much about the Palestinian people. Only ever met a few that lived here and they seemed fine to me. They came here for a reason though. Probably didn't want to die in a random bombing. The little bit I have seen about how Israel treats Palestinians, I don't blame them for leaving. Regarding the Palestinian soldier saying he would die for the Ayatollah, I've seen the same shit for Israel's soldiers. No one here is justified, they're just a bunch of religious zealots and people with grudges using religion as an excuse. Neither side is innocent.

I'll admit, I don't know all the ins and outs of the situation. What I see is a bunch of religious fanatics (both sides) doing horrible stuff. All over a piece of land. A piece of land is just that, a piece of land. All this religious stuff is meaningless. If I murder one person, does my motive matter? Why is it any different when thousands of people are murdered? Is this just Thomas Carlyle's "great man" theory in practice? Kill one man and you're a murderer, kill a thousand and you're a great man.

Here's my new solution. Put all the leaders in jail, throw away the key. If the next leaders follow the same path, they go to jail as well. Keep doing that until the leaders get their shit together. That's one of the main problems with the world as a whole. Leaders get to do as they please, using their population as pawns. We need to start holding leaders more accountable and rejecting religion as an excuse.

If my children/parents/friends had been killed by Israel or Palestine, I'd probably spit on the body of their soldiers as well. Fortunately, I was born here and don't have to consider that type of stuff.

 

[poupsy]

1. IDK, but it seems like they picked the worst possible place. Kind of makes me wonder if it was intentional. Disrupt the middle-east, provide support to the source of the disruption, carry on with Western progress as the middle-east fights among themselves. We're still fighting the Crusades, we're just using different tactics.

2. Why do villages matter? They had a different way of life that didn't involve milking the land dry. I'd hate to give up my modern conveniences, but maybe their way of life was better in the long run. I'll bet climate change wouldn't be as big an issue if we were living their way. Maybe I wouldn't spend most my summer days sweating my balls off.

3. I don't know much about the Palestinian people. Only ever met a few that lived here and they seemed fine to me. They came here for a reason though. Probably didn't want to die in a random bombing. The little bit I have seen about how Israel treats Palestinians, I don't blame them for leaving. Regarding the Palestinian soldier saying he would die for the Ayatollah, I've seen the same shit for Israel's soldiers. No one here is justified, they're just a bunch of religious zealots and people with grudges using religion as an excuse. Neither side is innocent.

I'll admit, I don't know all the ins and outs of the situation. What I see is a bunch of religious fanatics (both sides) doing horrible stuff. All over a piece of land. A piece of land is just that, a piece of land. All this religious stuff is meaningless. If I murder one person, does my motive matter? Why is it any different when thousands of people are murdered? Is this just Thomas Carlyle's "great man" theory in practice? Kill one man and you're a murderer, kill a thousand and you're a great man.

Here's my new solution. Put all the leaders in jail, throw away the key. If the next leaders follow the same path, they go to jail as well. Keep doing that until the leaders get their shit together. That's one of the main problems with the world as a whole. Leaders get to do as they please, using their population as pawns. We need to start holding leaders more accountable and rejecting religion as an excuse.

If my children/parents/friends had been killed by Israel or Palestine, I'd probably spit on the body of their soldiers as well. Fortunately, I was born here and don't have to consider that type of stuff.

Clearly you don’t know a lot about israelis and Palestinians
Most israelis are not fanatics neither religious ( and extremes religious ones are not genocidal )
Most Palestinians are unfortunately indoctrinated to hate kill jews and die for the cause
Israelis muslims and jews live together in relative harmony and equal rights
The 2 society are completely opposite

 

[minutemenX]

1. IDK, but it seems like they picked the worst possible place. Kind of makes me wonder if it was intentional. Disrupt the middle-east, provide support to the source of the disruption, carry on with Western progress as the middle-east fights among themselves. We're still fighting the Crusades, we're just using different tactics.

I believe a lot of your statements are out of ignorance which you have openly admitted but went ahead with suggestions anyway. These are some historical facts.

Palestine was not actually the first place assigned to the Jews and not the most desirable place. In the middle of 1930’s, Joseph Stalin created an Autonomous Jewish Region in the middle of Siberia with intent to relocate all Soviet Jews there. The second world war has interfered with these plans, but he started preparing mass deportation at the beginning of 1950’s. Fortunately he died before going with it. The Jewish Zionist movement at the beginning of 20 century has considered Palestine to be too barren and inhospitable for the Jewish state. It was very sparsely populated due to luck of water resources and the terrible malaria swamps on the coast. Read Mark Twain diary on his journey to Jerusalem in 19th century. He writes that it looks like the worst place on Earth and it was hard to believe that Jews had states there 2000 years ago. Zionist Jews wanted first (1903) land in Uganda in Africa for the Jewish state but the Brits as colonial rulers were against it. Instead, Jews were given Palestine to settle according to Balfour declaration (1917) after breakup of the Ottoman empire because nobody at that time considered it to worth anything. The Arabs started only to move in in mass when thousand of Jews arrived in 20’s of the last century rapidly revitalizing land and commerce. And now when Israel became an exemplary piece of the real estate with excellent infrastructure, water management, cities and irrigated agricultural land everybody wants it.

 

[Halloween Mike]

1. IDK, but it seems like they picked the worst possible place. Kind of makes me wonder if it was intentional. Disrupt the middle-east, provide support to the source of the disruption, carry on with Western progress as the middle-east fights among themselves. We're still fighting the Crusades, we're just using different tactics.

2. Why do villages matter? They had a different way of life that didn't involve milking the land dry.

3. I don't know much about the Palestinian people. Only ever met a few that lived here and they seemed fine to me.

I'll admit, I don't know all the ins and outs of the situation. What I see is a bunch of religious fanatics (both sides) doing horrible stuff.

Here's my new solution. Put all the leaders in jail, throw away the key.

If my children/parents/friends had been killed by Israel or Palestine, I'd probably spit on the body of their soldiers as well. Fortunately, I was born here and don't have to consider that type of stuff.

1) The Crusade? I think we long past that in here. We may not be perfect as a society but we moved on from religious zealots and such in North America. USA is still too religious for my taste (compare to us) but its still a laic society.

2) You think they wouldn't had evolved at some point doing the same we do? Likely yeah... they were just behind. Hey im all for environement too don't get me wrong but we must understand that the "granola way" is not really possible on a mass scale today.

3) You didn't met a Palestinian then, you met a Canadian that claim perpetual refugee status and thats the most asburde thing i ever heard of. Its like that dude Hemzah who does Youtube (and got destroyed by Sahar in a debate), he claim to be "from Palestine" but the dude was born in the US and simply can't understand the reality of the region. He preys on young (often underage) Israelis who barely speak English to make his content. I watch a fair chunk of his stuff and its clear he is not honest.

Put all the leaders in jail? Lol well yeah i don't think it would do much... If anything that sound too close to what Putin does to his opponent in Russia... maybe you have some dictator gene in you my friend

Last point is the only thing i can give you. But at the same time its also the price of deradicalization... If your whole family was radicalize, you may end up seeing them "die for the cause" and that does not mean the cause is just... I really recommand you to watch American History X, such a good movie... and how hatred can affect familly.

 

[Zero_Six]

1) The Crusade? I think we long past that in here. We may not be perfect as a society but we moved on from religious zealots and such in North America. USA is still too religious for my taste (compare to us) but its still a laic society.

2) You think they wouldn't had evolved at some point doing the same we do? Likely yeah... they were just behind. Hey im all for environement too don't get me wrong but we must understand that the "granola way" is not really possible on a mass scale today.

3) You didn't met a Palestinian then, you met a Canadian that claim perpetual refugee status and thats the most asburde thing i ever heard of. Its like that dude Hemzah who does Youtube (and got destroyed by Sahar in a debate), he claim to be "from Palestine" but the dude was born in the US and simply can't understand the reality of the region. He preys on young (often underage) Israelis who barely speak English to make his content. I watch a fair chunk of his stuff and its clear he is not honest.

Put all the leaders in jail? Lol well yeah i don't think it would do much... If anything that sound too close to what Putin does to his opponent in Russia... maybe you have some dictator gene in you my friend

Last point is the only thing i can give you. But at the same time its also the price of deradicalization... If your whole family was radicalize, you may end up seeing them "die for the cause" and that does not mean the cause is just... I really recommand you to watch American History X, such a good movie... and how hatred can affect familly.

1. Religion has always been a cover for "us vs them". America's continuing the crusade, they just aren't calling it that or giving religion as the excuse. Now it's terrorist cells and weapons of mass-destruction. And instead of doing all the bombing themselves, they get Israel to do it for them or just stir up tensions enough to get one group of Muslims to attack a slightly different group of Muslims. It's in America's best interest for the middle-east to be as chaotic as possible, just so long as the factories continue to pump out cheap garments and such for us.

2. I don't think "evolve" is the right word. That implies that one is better than the other. I love my tech, but does it make the world a better place? For every positive, there's plenty of negatives. Do we really even need 8.2 billion people on Earth? That being said, I can't see myself ever giving up my tech or moving out to the middle of nowhere and being self-sustaining. I'd be dead in a matter of weeks (probably days).

3. How many of us here have met a born and raised Palestinian? Or better yet, been to the area? Watching videos doesn't really count since any video we watch has a motive and narrative that the creator decides on.

4. Dictators are the ones against leaders being held responsible for their actions. Not sure why you'd lump me in with them. Do you think Putin shouldn't go to jail, or at least stand trial? If leaders were held responsible, they'd be a lot less likely to start wars and such. I guess that's kind of the purpose of the UN and ICC. They don't seem to do a very good job though.

Have seen American History X a couple times, though not lately. Great movie. Have you watched Romper Stomper? It's of the same vein and pretty good.

 

[Jacobisrael]

1) The Crusade? I think we long past that in here. We may not be perfect as a society but we moved on from religious zealots and such in North America. USA is still too religious for my taste (compare to us) but its still a laic society.

2) You think they wouldn't had evolved at some point doing the same we do? Likely yeah... they were just behind. Hey im all for environement too don't get me wrong but we must understand that the "granola way" is not really possible on a mass scale today.

3) You didn't met a Palestinian then, you met a Canadian that claim perpetual refugee status and thats the most asburde thing i ever heard of. Its like that dude Hemzah who does Youtube (and got destroyed by Sahar in a debate), he claim to be "from Palestine" but the dude was born in the US and simply can't understand the reality of the region. He preys on young (often underage) Israelis who barely speak English to make his content. I watch a fair chunk of his stuff and its clear he is not honest.

Put all the leaders in jail? Lol well yeah i don't think it would do much... If anything that sound too close to what Putin does to his opponent in Russia... maybe you have some dictator gene in you my friend

Last point is the only thing i can give you. But at the same time its also the price of deradicalization... If your whole family was radicalize, you may end up seeing them "die for the cause" and that does not mean the cause is just... I really recommand you to watch American History X, such a good movie... and how hatred can affect familly.

1) The Crusade? I think we long past that in here. We may not be perfect as a society but we moved on from religious zealots and such in North America. USA is still too religious for my taste (compare to us) but its still a laic society.

2) You think they wouldn't had evolved at some point doing the same we do? Likely yeah... they were just behind. Hey im all for environement too don't get me wrong but we must understand that the "granola way" is not really possible on a mass scale today.

3) You didn't met a Palestinian then, you met a Canadian that claim perpetual refugee status and thats the most asburde thing i ever heard of. Its like that dude Hemzah who does Youtube (and got destroyed by Sahar in a debate), he claim to be "from Palestine" but the dude was born in the US and simply can't understand the reality of the region. He preys on young (often underage) Israelis who barely speak English to make his content. I watch a fair chunk of his stuff and its clear he is not honest.

Put all the leaders in jail? Lol well yeah i don't think it would do much... If anything that sound too close to what Putin does to his opponent in Russia... maybe you have some dictator gene in you my friend

Last point is the only thing i can give you. But at the same time its also the price of deradicalization... If your whole family was radicalize, you may end up seeing them "die for the cause" and that does not mean the cause is just... I really recommand you to watch American History X, such a good movie... and how hatred can affect familly.

Are u Jewish?

 

[EagerBeaver]

Are u Jewish?

Are you? Your handle certainly implies as much

 

[Jacobisrael]

Are you? Your handle certainly implies as much

I am but I’m asking our friend cause he seems knowledgeable. I abstain from talking politics. But it seems passionate here lol

 

[EagerBeaver]

I am but I’m asking our friend cause he seems knowledgeable. I abstain from talking politics. But it seems passionate here lol

I think Halloween Mike is a Gentile if I am guessing (I have met him and I think he is French Canadian 100%), but he is a Jew's Goy, if you know what I mean. His arguments are based on passion and informing himself on a subject. I am surmising they are not based on any ties to the homeland.

 

[Jacobisrael]

I think Halloween Mike is a Gentile if I am guessing (I have met him and I think he is French Canadian 100%), but he is a Jew's Goy, if you know what I mean. His arguments are based on passion and informing himself on a subject. They are not based on any ties to the homeland. My mother was an Israeli and served in the IDF, may she RIP. She was an Uzi specialist.

May hashem give her neshama aliyah. Some goyim go extreme on Palestinians when they are not all bad. Fine there is Hamas but that could be a bad look for Jews. Some are ill intentionned and use to this to get to Arabs. Don’t want to be scapegoated and that random people say Jews are racist. Anyways I’ll stop it there. I came here looking for nice SPs. Boobs and tits. I Will leave the arguing to you guys. Cheers and Shabbat shalom

 

[Halloween Mike]

Are u Jewish?

I am not. Atheist/Non-Believer.

I am but I’m asking our friend cause he seems knowledgeable.

I spent a lot of time researching on this since Oct 7 2023

I have met him and I think he is French Canadian 100%. His arguments are based on passion and informing himself on a subject. I am surmising they are not based on any ties to the homeland.

Exactly

Some goyim go extreme on Palestinians when they are not all bad. Fine there is Hamas but that could be a bad look for Jews. Some are ill intentionned and use to this to get to Arabs. Don’t want to be scapegoated and that random people say Jews are racist.

Obviously not everyone is bad. But as i mentioned previously there is a systemic hatred and religious extremism when it comes to Gaza and even to a degree parts of the Judea and Samaria (Westbank). I made it clear before my problem is not with "Arabs" but it is toward extremist islamists. Both actual terrorists who commit the deeds, but also peoples who support the idea even if they don't commit the atrocities themselves (either promoting it or defending it). I never pretend to speak on behaf of any Jews. And Islam is not a race

 

[Halloween Mike]

1. Religion has always been a cover for "us vs them". America's continuing the crusade, they just aren't calling it that or giving religion as the excuse.

2. I don't think "evolve" is the right word. That implies that one is better than the other. I love my tech, but does it make the world a better place?

3. How many of us here have met a born and raised Palestinian? Or better yet, been to the area? Watching videos doesn't really count since any video we watch has a motive and narrative that the creator decides on.

4. Dictators are the ones against leaders being held responsible for their actions. Not sure why you'd lump me in with them. Do you think Putin shouldn't go to jail, or at least stand trial? If leaders were held responsible, they'd be a lot less likely to start wars and such. I guess that's kind of the purpose of the UN and ICC. They don't seem to do a very good job though.

Have seen American History X a couple times, though not lately. Great movie. Have you watched Romper Stomper? It's of the same vein and pretty good.

1. Well i disagree on this

2. Its not about tech but about ways of life. For instance not having recourse to barbaric form of punishement like lashes or torture. I read recently that in Pakistan (if not mistaking) a guy raped someones daughter and as punishment he "agreed" that his own sister be raped by the brother of his victim in public. Thats one of the worst thing i could read. You commit a crime and the punishment is pass on a relative instead of you. And its not jail time either... its fn rape !! Obviously women's rights, LGBTQ rights and so on also are part of what i meant in "evolved".

3. Not much of us, but what is the point? Someone born in the US who call himself Palestinians is not more Palestinians that i am from France...

4. Putin definately should be on trial. But as you say the UN/ICC has no real power. Simple fact that Russia has a permanent seat at the UN and can veto just about anything is a paradox in itself. How can we informe anything? There is no way but to launch a war against a regime, wich negate the idea itself.

I didn't watch Romper Stomper but i heard about it. This one i have on my "gotta watch it one day for sure" list. Believe it or not there is many "classics" i have yet to watch like the Godfather trilogy. But truth is, when it comes to "old movies" (Rumper ain't that old tough i know) i space them out as they are not my "goto usuals". Recently i bough The Departed from the local library so its next on my list to watch in term of "story driven longer movies".